The Navy went into damage control mode last week after admitting that, indeed, an Air Force version of the V-22 Osprey did experience icing problems at 18,000 feet and did an unscheduled landing in Prescott, Arizona. At first, the Navy classified the incident as a Class C “mishap,” which means damages could be as high as $200,000, and admitted that both engines were damaged. However, a story on Monday in Inside the Navy (pay site) said the incident was now being labeled a Class B “mishap,” meaning the damages could cost up to $1 million, and that there was “superficial” damage to the tail section of the aircraft.
The Navy also is beginning to parse its words very carefully, claiming that the pilot and crew were never in danger, but that the incident called for a “land-as-soon-as-practical emergency,” as opposed to a “land-as-soon-as-possible emergency,” according to Inside the Navy.
Our sources told us that the aircraft, CV-22 #6, flew into a storm cloud and experienced a compressor stall after encountering icing problems.The aircraft didn’t recover to full power until reaching warmer air at about 10,000 feet.
The Navy says there was no engine shut down, but rather a computer generated power reduction when the aircraft’s sensors first recognized the problem. The Navy, which runs the V-22 program for both the Marines and Air Force, says it suspects the incident was the result of ice being ingested in the aircraft’s engines. Our sources, however, say a compressor stall, caused by restricted air flow into the engine’s fan blades, isn’t a routine matter – even if the engines don’t “flameout,” or shut down totally. A compressor stall can include only a power reduction.
Any compressor stall typically results in a loss of engine power. Some may barely register on an aircraft’s engine instruments, others can shut down the engine completely. In this case, Inside the Navy story noted that there was damage to the compressor blades of both engines and some ice damage to the fire door in one of the aircraft’s nacelles. Even if there was no total loss of power, given the amount of damages, it seems unlikely the incident was not serious.
Despite the Navy’s reassurances, our sources, who are aviation experts, are still concerned. A compressor stall can pose serious problems for any aircraft. In fact, the April 2001 report of the V-22 Blue Ribbon Task Force (pdf) blamed a V-22 accident in 1992 that killed seven crewmembers and contract passengers on an engine failure. “The reason for the engine failure was compressor stall and fire due to oil ingestion. Oil had leaked from the proprotor gearbox area and pooled in the lower inlet lip area, dumping into the engine during nacelle conversion,” the report noted.
Here’s yet another concern: We wonder what the aircraft was doing flying into a storm in the first place. One source tells us that, after 20 years of development and testing, this was actually the first time a V-22 without operational de-icing equipment flew into storm clouds. That’s consistent with a finding by the General Accountability Office, which in 2001 told the V-22 blue ribbon panel that the aircraft was not cleared to operate in icing conditions – the formal requirement for icing equipment had been waived by the Navy – and testing was incomplete. In fact, the GAO said that V-22 pilots were not permitted to fly within 25 nautical miles of a storm cloud formation (pdf; page 10).
Last month, the Pentagon cleared the V-22 for full-rate production. Meanwhile, the aircraft’s de-icing system is still being tested, but it apparently has not been scrutinized yet by the Pentagon’s top independent tester, the Director of Operation Test and Evaluation. There was no mention of any testing of the de-icing system in the September DOT&E testing report (pdf) that gave the aircraft mostly passing grades.
At this point, it’s not clear how many V-22 aircraft will get de-icing equipment--V-22 program manager spokesperson James Darcy says that they all will, though CV-22 #6 does not. The V-22 is not just a helicopter, the greater part of its missions are flown in aircraft mode and speeds far greater than any helicopter, and sometimes at higher altitudes. As one expert pointed out to us, the aircraft has two sets of aerodynamics, featuring two different lift principals.
Is it really safe to send the V-22 into combat without a de-icing system? Why aren’t de-icing systems already onboard an aircraft that the Pentagon says is ready for prime time? Shouldn't the Defense Department make sure the V-22 has all its major problems fixed before committing to spending billions more?
There is one concern with anti-ice systems is that there is a performance loss when the systems are in use. The V-22’s flight manual notes that when anti-ice systems are activated, the aircraft’s performance decreases by up to 10 percent. However, according to Darcy, "...the full weight of the de-icing system is already factored into all range and performance projections for the operational V-22."
While we'll admit that we engaged in a bit of hyperbole when we said the V-22 "can't fly through clouds," the real concern is that the folks in the V-22 program have their heads in the clouds.
The Corps should cancel this project and reallocate the funds toward a replacement medium lift chopper to replace the CH-46's and just buy more CH/MH 53's. It cost too much per lift-mile ($'s per pound of lift per mile of lift). The replacement cost of each Osprey (and they will be lost due to combat or accidents) would buy multiple helicopters that are nearly as capable, a known quantity, and much more affordable. When they came out to the Marine Staff-NCO academy to update us on the status of this program, I told them they were setting us up for a ride into a fight in gold-plated battle cadillacs. Needless to say I got a frown. I am NOT a Luddite and generally believe that newer technologies have a useful place on the battlefield when they confer a distinct advantage with respect to the conflict that is being waged. The Ospey confers no distinct advantage to a conventional expeditionary force like the Marines that is fighting a land based conflict with an unconventional enemy. In fact, they have a larger footprint and will be less able to deliver troops and supplies into tight LZ's. They also take up more space in a carrier, reducing the total number of aircraft deployable on a single platform.
On the other hand, the Osprey would be useful as a Special Ops delivery vehicle, being relatively fast and having a good payload and a relatively smaller redar signature. It could deliver special ops teams or supplies to distant locations with less time exposure over hostile territories.
Also Ospreys could be useful for Coast Guard SAR missions to distant points where time is of the essence.
Hand this over to another service and get back to basics, buy more or newer choppers.
Ed Johnson
Posted by: Edward Johnson | Nov 12, 2005 at 11:47 AM
I think there's a few things that need to be clarified. The V-22 needs a de-icing system. NAVAIR,as Joe pointed out, even says that all production MV-22s will have them and should. And a de-icing system is being developed. If anything, the event on Oct 18th underscores the need for an anti-ice system.
This issue alone isn't significant, as long as a working de-icing system is developed and incorporated in V-22s. What is significant is that many weapon systems, such as the V-22, are fielded with major deficiencies that should have been solved during OPEVAL or shortly thereafter. Hopefully the de-icing issue won't be a problem for too much longer. But even if it is resolved there are numerous issues with the V-22 including its cost (Joe's "strategic procurement level" argument), the fact that "It can’t autorotate to a safe landing, has no defensive gun, lacks the ability to perform quick evasive combat maneuvers under fire, and can’t descend too quickly or it will go into a dangerous roll."
Posted by: Nick at POGO | Nov 02, 2005 at 02:51 PM
Katz is often right and I usually appreciate his insight. Although I'm suspect of some of his comments because he apparently doesn't live in America. However, Brad to compare the V-22 compressor issue to your car radio is beyond silly. Unless you're driving a Kia when was the last time your radio disrupted power in your car engine? I'll let POGO comment for themselves, I think the blogger is a Nick, but they have complained about a lot more than just this one problem. I think they have an entire laundry list of concerns. It is probably somewhere on that web site of theirs. They do need to do more about pointing out weapons that work.
Posted by: Phil | Nov 02, 2005 at 11:58 AM
Katzman is right. The V22 is slated to replace my old bird, the H46E and it is open to considerable criticism over whether it can provide even that old utility. On the other hand, a deicing regime is hardly a make or break impossible-to-incorporate change, even if it was an actual problem. Over the lifetime of the airframe massive changes will be needed, such as assuredly engine, drive, hydraulic, avionic and computer components, that will be far more invasive and material than heating inlet surfaces or separating inlet particulates.
If this, for the sake of argument, is your most pointed criticism of the program, it would be safe, it would in fact be absolutely incumbent upon a fair observer to point out that fixing the issue would save far more money than abandoning the entire program. It would be like trading in your car because you didn't like the radio.
Posted by: Brad | Nov 02, 2005 at 10:08 AM
POGO asks: "Why aren’t de-icing systems already onboard an aircraft that the Pentagon says is ready for prime time?"
How about, because it's an early-model test aircraft?
"Our sources told us that the aircraft, CV-22 #6, flew into a storm cloud and experienced a compressor stall"
Well, apparently it wasn't just a storm cloud, it was prolonged flight in hostile conditions. And the Navy says no stall. Someone here is either lying or mistaken - and if your source got the environmental aspect wrong, it suggests that the other stuff is also likely to be wrong.
"Is it really safe to send the V-22 into combat without a de-icing system?"
Apparently not, which is why producton MV-22s will have one per NAVAIR's clear response. You're being deliberately obtuse here. And I'll add that I'm a Canadian, so I know what it means when they said they've done 5 months of de-icing testing already in Nova Scotia. Something you didn't mention, but which was in an article you cited.
There's plenty to criticize about the V-22 on a strategic procurement level, and on a tactical mobility level as well, without stuff that, IMO, borders on deliberate untruthfulness. Recommend you stick to the points above that are solid (manual that notes power loss with de-icing - though that could = "factored in", newer Navy reports of damage/ mishap class, why were they in storm clouds in the first place, etc.), and abandon/ concede the parts that are insupportable and the questions that call your judgment into question.
Posted by: Joe Katzman | Nov 01, 2005 at 04:58 PM